S1|Ep60 A Multi-Million Dollar Journey of Entrepreneurship: Redefining Success & Strategy to Design a Life You Love

In this powerful episode of Digital Transformation & AI for Humans, we explore a masterclass in modern entrepreneurship with Sze Wong, a seasoned tech entrepreneur, inventor, and venture investor from Virginia, USA.

Prior to founding Zerion Software, he designed major mobile systems for industry leaders like Sun Microsystems, Nextel Communications, and Shell Oil. With 7 US patents in data and data security, Sze’s contributions have had a lasting impact on the tech industry.

Today, as a venture investor at Zenith Venture Studio, Sze leverages his extensive entrepreneurial experience to support and invest in emerging startups that are poised to transform their industries.

His unique blend of hands-on experience and innovative thinking enables him to mentor founders and drive the next generation of disruptive digital solutions.

Sze shares his hard-won wisdom on building a future-proof business, redefining success, and balancing growth with happiness in the age of AI and digital transformation.

🚀 Key Topics Explored:

• Sze’s early days in tech and the mindset behind his success
• Lessons from building award-winning platforms and scaling with purpose
• Top 3 strategic moves he’d make if launching a business in 2025
• Turning setbacks into stepping stones for exponential growth
• Redefining success for the next decade of entrepreneurs
• How to protect your happiness while growing big
• Skills, mindset shifts, and game-changing opportunities for 2025–2030
• The one piece of advice every impact-driven entrepreneur needs to hear

Whether you're a founder, visionary, or future-focused leader, this episode will inspire you to reclaim your power, align your strategy, and build a life you deeply love.

🎧 Subscribe for more episodes that blend AI, entrepreneurship, emotional intelligence, and visionary leadership.

🔗 AI Game Changers Club – your exclusive community for thought leaders and innovators shaping the future with AI and human-centric leadership: http://aigamechangers.club

Chapters

• 0:00 Introduction to Sze Wong
• 2:19 Early Entrepreneurial Journey
• 6:00 Mindset
• 10:05 Being Intentional About Your Path
• 17:36 Solving Boring Problems
• 28:10 Handling Failure and Success
• 36:57 Business as a Video Game
• 41:52 Being Resourceful in Uncertain Times
• 45:00 Final Advice

Transcript

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 0:00

Hello and welcome to Digital Transformation and AI for Humans with your host, Amy. In this podcast, we delve into how technology intersects with leadership, innovation and, most importantly, the human spirit. Each episode features visionary leaders who understand that at the heart of success is the human touch nurturing a winning mindset, fostering emotional intelligence and building resilient teams. I'm excited to welcome my fantastic guest, Sze Wong, from Virginia, the United States, to hear his story about the multi-million dollar journey of entrepreneurship. Let's redefine success and strategy and learn how to design a life you love. Thank you.

Sze Wong: 0:44

Thank you, emi, great to be here. Design a life you love. Thank you. Thank you, emi, great to be here.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 0:48

Amazing to have you here, Sze! Sze is a seasoned entrepreneur, inventor, educator and venture investor. Prior to founding Zerion Software, he designed major mobile systems for industry leaders like Sun Microsystems, nextel Communications and Shell Oil, with seven US patents in data and data security. These contributions have had a lasting impact on the tech industry. As a venture investor at Zenith Venture Studio, zil leverages his extensive entrepreneurial experience to support and invest in emerging startups that are poised to transform their industries. His unique blend of hands-on experience and innovative thinking enables him to mentor founders and drive the next generation of disruptive digital solutions. Let's start the conversation and transform not just our technologies but our ways of thinking and leading, and if you are interested in connecting or collaborating, you can find more information in the description below. Subscribe and stay tuned for more episodes. Sze, it's so great to have you here. To start our conversation. I would love to hear a few words about your journey, about your story, about you.

Sze Wong: 2:15

Okay, yeah, Thanks for inviting me. It's great to be here. Great podcast my story, I think let's start with. I started my first company one year prior to graduate from college. So back then it was just three young people Like we were. Just we think we can conquer the world. So we started a consulting gig and then, long story short, that didn't go anywhere. We graduated, went and worked for other people. That didn't go anywhere. We graduated, went and worked for other people.

Sze Wong: 2:46

I would say about a few years later I started. Well, a few years later I got invited to teach for like a training school. So at that time Java was very new, very hot, and at that time you can actually get a job quite easily after joining a bootcamp. So I went and worked for that company and I and I thought, wow, that they can make a lot of money. So so I said, well, why don't I start? So I started my own training school.

Sze Wong: 3:13

In the next about three years I was having a full-time job and I teach every night, three hours of the night, five days a week, and then on Saturday and Sunday, both nights I taught nine hours on Saturday and Sunday and so that was like almost three years. That venture taught me basic accounting, even though, like that seemed to be, I mean, successful In the first six months, eight months, there was, like a lot of people signing up and then got so many I mean I rented a tiny room for my classroom I mean I was just by myself, Right so it was their only standing room only. Like every Saturday we had an info session and then people will come to try to sign up, and then people will come to try to sign up, and now things that I don't know. I was too focused on. What I'm doing is the grand, like the big environment. Dotcom has crashed, Right, and then, while I was so focused on doing my own that I didn't know outside of my little bubble, so, and things got tougher in the next couple of years. I didn't know it was because of the bigger environment. I thought it was like I need to work harder. So I work harder and I spend more time, I spend more money advertising and then put more energy into it and ended up losing money without knowing, like, basic accounting, like I said. So at the end I closed it, I left that venture and learned how to manage cash flow, and that taught me a great lesson.

Sze Wong: 4:58

And now and then the last chapter well, the last chapter of my life was this little thing called the iPhone came out and I remember I was in a contract in some company. The architect I was the technical architect at that point the architect next to me showed me an iPhone at that point and he showed me he wrote a tic-tac-toe game on that iPhone and he said he made more money in three weeks on the iPhone product, on the iPhone tic-tac-toe, than he would make in that company for three months. He told me he's quitting, he's going all in on the iPhone and he said Z, you need to do this, we miss our 80s, this is our 80s. So you got to quit and go in and at that weekend I bought my first Mac. Actually, I never had a Mac, I had an Apple II growing up. So that weekend, 2008, summer of 2008, I got my first Mac, got into iOS development and then start this little company, and so I'm good now. So maybe too long of a story I'm good now.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 6:05

Maybe too long of a story, but let's stop there. That's incredibly inspiring. Thank you so much for sharing and you told about such moments in life where really working hard and fighting for growing a business and fighting for growing a business it's also easier to understand how your journey went, from where you were in the beginning to where you are today, and that is so inspiring. Thank you so much for sharing and looking back your journey from designing mobile systems for those big companies like Sun, microsystems and Shell to founding Xero and Software and building this iForm Builder, one of the first mobile apps to earn Apple's recognition as an essential iPhone app for business. What pushed you to become who you are today? Was there a certain moment, except what you already mentioned, or certain event or thought which transformed your journey? What internal mindset or belief made the biggest difference in turning this early experience into breakthrough success?

Sze Wong: 7:19

Yeah, I wouldn't call myself breakthrough success, but mean, if you, if you ask about what, what drive me to work is the desire to just do whatever I I desire. I hate following um and and I and I had mentioned I start my first company uh, before graduate from college. It's is the desire to start a company. I don't know why and I encourage everybody to try, especially if you're young, and that's because I feel like in our generation and actually it becomes more so now that in the AI world that you can start your company far easier than before. Like Amy, you're doing a podcast. This is your own venture. Doing your own thing is far easier than the last generation. Or even when I start, when I start in iPhone Builder 2008, comparing to now, the friction is a lot less. All the problem is still the problem. You just have to solve problem. And so I mean, from a mindset perspective other than the desire to just start, don't follow.

Sze Wong: 8:28

Create the world that you like is the desire to look for problems you can solve. You can always solve. There are enough problems in the world outside of you, around you, in you. There are enough problems. Just solve them. If you solve enough problems, you can make a good living. I'll continue to do that and I'll continue as I get older. I'll do the same thing, but differently.

Sze Wong: 8:50

Right when I was in my 20s, 30s. My superpower is not sleep. I don't sleep In college. I sleep once every three days. When I was in my 20s, I loved Saturday and Sunday because I don't sleep. I have 48 more hours to get ahead of you. Now that I'm getting older, I know that I have to pay back those times. So now I stopped doing that. I am going to sleep, but still.

Sze Wong: 9:18

The key is to try to solve problems around you and if you do that, you can aim at a world that you like to live in. I say this I wrote a book called Craft your World, and that is basically just to say the world that you live in. It's actually quite small. It is constructed by 100, 150 people that you interact with every single day or on a daily basis. That is your world, and yes, I'm not talking about changing or moving the earth. That world, that's not our world. That is the world. Our world is just the people that you interact with, and if you take control of who you interact with, then you can control your journey and to me, the easiest thing to do is through entrepreneurship is to start your own thing. Start your podcast, start your company. Solving simple problem I mean taking picture for people teaching people how to swim. I mean whatever you desire. You can aim to focus on that solve problems around you and you can build a good life.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 10:29

This is so beautiful and so impactful at the same time, and I believe that many, many need this message today.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 10:41

They need to hear exactly this reminder that the world is big but at the same time, it's smaller than we're used to see, and actually we are an average of five closest people around us that's right so it is so important and I totally share this philosophy that it is important to make sure that the world, your world, the world you are constructing and living in it, is as you would like it to see, and that you are in control of who is a part of that world and how it looks like. So thank you so much for sharing this. What were the key strategies or decisions that helped you not only scale business-wise but design that life you truly love we just mentioned, and how would you advise entrepreneurs to approach this today?

Sze Wong: 11:47

um, I think like the easiest thing is be intentional. It's very easy to be on autopilot, right? So I always talked about people who somehow graduate. You get your first job. You'll be defined by your first job, right, who you are. You'll be a developer, your DBA, your designer, your teacher, whatever right so like. But your first job should not define you. A lot of people got their first job and then just flow right, so they get better at becoming a teacher or whoever.

Sze Wong: 12:17

Try to stop and think about where you want to be in 10 years time. Every single year, right, every single year. You say, well, 10 years later, who I want to be Now? Maybe, if you're rich, you want to be a billionaire. Maybe that's what you want to do. But I'll inject another thing Don't ever put money as your objective. Money should be something that you will get if you get successful. But if you only aim at money, you get lost very quickly. So you need to aim at solving some problem that you're good at and around that time, be very intentional.

Sze Wong: 12:55

Let's say, you grow up like I have a lot of developer friends around me, so they will grow up being a good developer or good DBA, database administrator, and when they get to their 30s and 40s, a lot of them will say, well, I hate my job. Then I mean I was like just quit. Now, at that point they will say, no, I can't, I have this and I have that. That is true. That's why you have to plan, and I can share experiences. Right now I'm in my 50s, I'm getting older. Now, today, I can still pretend, I can still say I'm still quite smart, I still move fast, I could still learn fast. But that won't last. In 10 years, in 15 years, in 20 years, I will inevitably slow down. So the time to plan for the next 10, 15, 20 years is right now. So right now I am trying to plan what it will look like when I'm slowing down. How do I want my life to be? And you plan for it.

Sze Wong: 14:00

When I was in my 30s, I remember talking to friends around me so we were all like high paying developers, right. So like, if you think back, being a developer, I always say I'm lucky that I learned programming in the 90s, because that's like in the next few decades, being a developer is amazing. I was in the right place at the right time. But when I was in my early 30s. A lot of my friends are making good money and I look at myself like I can't simply continue developing because I will slow down. I may be able to go faster than an 18 euro, but are people going to pay me two times, three times, four times? Well, I can never get to like maybe beyond three times because I can never develop faster than 10 people.

Sze Wong: 14:54

So at that time I intentionally changed to a management role. I need to learn, I told myself. I need to learn how to manage people, how to be a better leader. Now, that's not natural, because if you're a good developer, you'll get more development jobs. You'll be a better, better development, like expert.

Sze Wong: 15:17

Well, things that you need to learn. You don't get a chance unless you intentionally go out and go find it. You don't get a chance unless you intentionally go out and go find it. And that's also like that skill end up being very useful when I have a bigger team in my company. So again, be intentional and don't be afraid to just learn. Now, I'm not saying you should jump, I mean people say you should just jump to a new thing. I understand like life is tough. So I'm not saying jump to a new thing. I understand like life is tough. So I'm not saying jump to your new thing, but you can try. You need to think about it and start doing something about it. And if life comes at you and tells you like you can't, if you want to go into a different direction and you cannot, that's okay, but at least you try.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 15:59

I I ask that you try I couldn't agree more because exactly we can't know for sure what is going to work and what is not, because it's very, very individual. But the main thing is that when we try, we eliminate that risk for filing regrets which are going to hit us when we reach a certain age, and we are going to look back and understand that we had so many chances to change the direction, to be who we wanted to be, and we didn't take the chance and we still kept staying in that comfort zone, which wasn't really comfortable. But it would take so much more courage to try something new. I support this vision 100%, I appreciate it and I'm happy that we're sharing it together with our listeners and viewers, with our listeners and viewers.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 17:04

And speaking about 10 years of planning, today the world is so unpredictable that's true. All those technologies, they are impacting the future and it's difficult to even know how the world will look like in two to three years. So what can you tell about 10 years? How to plan? Of course you can plan based on what you know, on the knowns, not on the unknowns, but still it is a very fast-paced, supersonic development.

Sze Wong: 17:40

Yeah, it is, and it's scary. I just read a book called Same as Ever and in there it was talked about there scary. I just read a book called Same as Ever and in there it was talked about. There are certain things that, no matter what happened, it wouldn't change. But let me first address the changing world, then I'll talk about the non-changing world. The changing world is AI is going to take over. I mean, I'm in that world right now. So I see it, it's very scary Things that used to take people weeks to do.

Sze Wong: 18:06

Now AI can do it in minutes and it's real Now at the same time. That's why I'm teaching vibe coding as fast as AI is moving. It's also create new skill set. So in software development it used to be you get a job and you need different people to work on it. You need analysts, you need architects, you need developers, you need designers. Now AI can do most of that. Now, not all yet. It's not great yet, but it will get better. So there's a new skill that came about. We call it prompting or call it vibe coding, and that's new skill that didn't exist a year ago. One year ago, nobody talked about vibe coding. Today a lot of people talk about it. A lot of people say AI is not good enough, but it will get good enough. So what I recommend especially developers, people who develop software is to learn that that's just a brand new skill.

Sze Wong: 19:07

I remember in the winter of 2009, I got calls from people looking for iOS developers and they asked, like, how much experience do you have? And my answer is I had as much experience as anybody could have, because at that point, at the winter of 2009, ios development was brand new. Nobody had more experience or like nobody has more experience at that point than I did. Right, maybe by a month at the most. Now that was tremendous opportunity. And today you have tremendous opportunity in using AI to solve real problems, because this is new. Like I said, vibe coding is one year old, so the most experienced vibe coding developer has one year of experience. So if you start today, you are just one year short of the most experience in the world. So that is tremendous opportunity. So that's the changing world Now. The non-changing world is the problem solving.

Sze Wong: 20:17

And laziness. If I talk about entrepreneurship, it's that I solve laziness right. So laziness will never go away when the world is like, when the world is super automatic when AI takes over the world. Still, people will be lazy. Right now we're clicking, like people are saying, well, a website is taking three clicks, well, let's make it one click. Okay, when it's one click, let's make it fully automatic.

Sze Wong: 20:43

Like Amazon is doing predictive shipment. I mean, that may not be a well-known thing that people talked about, but Amazon does this thing Like if they realize you may want something and they have room in the truck, they will preemptively ship something close to your home. Let's say, you order toilet paper every 30 days or thereabout. Right, they know that you will likely order it. They don't know, but they learn it. If their truck has room, they will ship those things closer to your home so that when you order, it shows up that afternoon and that's delightful. That is solving kind of the well, they're not solving the laziness per se, but these are the things that, like Amazon, continue to think about. How do they make that journey, that buying journey, easier and easier? And as I coach entrepreneurs, I'll always say, like, just solve laziness, you will not run out of things to do. People are so lazy. Just be a little bit less lazy than people around you. You have unlimited things to work on.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 21:55

That is so helpful for many, I believe, today and so simple in a way, but at the same time, it requires some innovative thinking and a creative approach to find out those problems to solve and those pain points you can monetize. So just to dig a little bit deeper if you were starting completely fresh today, in 2025, what would be your first three strategic moves to build a future-proof business?

Sze Wong: 22:34

well, I don't know about future proof, but if I, if I'm starting today, I mean I'm, I'm advising people to start today. You basically I mean at the time like I started training school in the past I I started in consulting school. Like, consulting is a forever business. Now consulting doesn't last. It's not a fully scalable business. Consulting means be a consulting Basically in today's world means you learn a little bit faster than the people around you.

Sze Wong: 23:04

If I were to start today, I will try to learn faster and in particular, in AI and in more particular in AI development, coding development. So it's my view that I'm very much in the software development world. The software development cost will trend to zero. It won't go to zero immediately, but it will trend down as time goes on. It will be cheaper and cheaper and cheaper. That means there are going to be more problems one can solve with the same amount of money. And realizing that you, or if I were like your question is, if I were starting today, I'll try to solve many more problems than before. I'll understand. I'll try to realize that I can now do more than before. I will do more on my own and I won't rely on people. That may be a sad reality, but today you can start solving problems much cheaper than before. So I remember in 2010-ish when I bought my first cloud server Now, at that time cloud was still kind of new. I was amazed because I can rent a server at $20 a month and it's a full server I can use right. If I go purchase a machine, it will cost a couple thousand dollars. I'd pay for internet and to run that machine, but renting that is $20. Now today you can rent, I mean with $20 a month. You can rent AI, right. You can buy Chetchi, bt and Call and all those are just $10, $20. So fully utilize AI to solve real problems. And the third link to that answer is that solve boring business problems.

Sze Wong: 24:53

When we start, when people start, they always think about the big thing that they can do. They can solve big, world-changing problems. I'm not against that, I understand that is great. But most people think like that. So go turn around and do something that people don't like, like I.

Sze Wong: 25:12

Go to this coffee shop every single morning and then there are two sections of the parking lot, one section. They're like packed. Everybody is right in front of the first door of the coffee shop. That is just packed and people fight for that space. But I drive a little bit further to the second door of the coffee shop. Now it's still closed by the door but nobody is there. So I park there and I'm still close to the door. It's not like I walk further to the door, but I drive further. I am going in from the second door.

Sze Wong: 25:45

So same here, when everybody is trying to change the world with AI doing big things, do boring things, solve boring, mundane business problems. I mean, we always talk about making a simple PDF builder. It's boring, but the people need it. There are even boring problems like I mean, in iPhone builder, we count fish. One of the stories is that there are people's jobs sitting under a dam right, so the dam blocks water from flowing and there's an office. There's a window inside the dam. Now, most people don't know that, but there is one that someone sits in that office with the window looking deep down under the dam and their job is to count fish. Like how boring is that? Like, your job is sit there eight hours a day and you count fish, fish, fish, fish and fish. Well, we solve that problem. We're like, okay, well, we make that fully automatic. I mean I won't go into the detail, but it it's some RFID and scanning it. You don't have to scan and count anymore.

Sze Wong: 26:51

Solving those type of boring problems always exist and looking for them most people won't go look for them. So if I were to start today, I go fully utilize AI. Don't even worry about mobile apps. People are still trying to build mobile apps, like I'm still building mobile apps, which is today's technology. But think ahead of time. In a few years, if development costs trend down to zero, if anybody can build a mobile app, that mobile app is no longer worth anything. They can be made on the fly. What does that look like? So that is the technical side of thinking. On the business side, just go look for boring problems. There will always be boring problems. Now people ask me well, how do I find them? I talk to people. The only solution is just go talk to people, ask people to complain to you. I mean, you get tired If you start talking to people and say, yeah, what do you hate? Well, you get your year full right and then tell me what do you hate about work? I mean, you get ideas. That's what I would work on.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 28:07

I love this brilliant, but those mobile developers, in this case, whose future is going to have a down-going trend they have to transform.

Sze Wong: 28:23

As a mobile developer, as any developer, I would say, you will have to transform just a kind reminder.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 28:30

It is about time. As any developer I would say, you will have to transform. Just a kind reminder. It is about time to transform for everybody. I totally agree, and now I'm thinking. You know, when you're going through a transformation, it's not always enjoyable, to say the least. It might hold a lot of pain, a lot of navigation outside of your comfort zone, correct and such hard moments where you need to decide, when you need to choose, when you need to take a step into the unknown. So can you share a time when you faced a major setback or failure or such really big doubt, and how you turned that challenge into a breakthrough opportunity that shaped your future success?

Sze Wong: 29:23

Right.

Sze Wong: 29:23

So I kind of already touched on it. I think my biggest failure may be yet to come. I'll have my big failure ahead of me. Hopefully I can hedge against that. But I talked about my training school. I thought I did great. So when I started there were standing room only. I made like full page advertisement. It was just awesome.

Sze Wong: 29:43

And when that failed I actually told myself, like, maybe I'm not cut out for business. I may be a good teacher, maybe I'm a good developer, but I may not be cut out for business world. So I actually at that time I told myself, ok, fine, if you can't run your own business, that's OK. You just work at some good company and be a great employee, that's okay, you just work at some good company and be a great employee. I and at that time actually, I got a pretty good um employer at the time, right after I closed my training school. I I joined that company and I thought, okay, it's a great company, so I can, I'll just work there and um, and accept my fate as as as not an entrepreneur. Um, so that is the big setback. And at the time I actually like, oh, a lot of money, I mean there, a lot of money.

Sze Wong: 30:35

Uh, to me at the time, the learning is that actually, one year after I closed the training school and worked for somebody, my internal, like itch came out. It was like I just don't want to work for somebody. I, my internal itch came out. It was like I just don't want to work for somebody, I want to start my own. I think what I realized is that I'd rather fail than accept, and failing takes courage. Now, when I restart, I wasn't thinking, okay, I'm going to fail again and I'll do it At that time actually armed with what I learned. It's actually what taught me a lot about cash flow that allowed me to manage money much better in the next couple of ventures. So, yeah, I mean that is a big deal, and that's the story I will tell.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 31:31

Beautiful and hopefully you will never need to go through such moments in life again.

Sze Wong: 31:39

I mean maybe. So right now I am seeing failure very differently. So I see failure as this step function where you fail and then you come back from a very different like. You fail and you come back up again, and then you fail and come back up again. Every up is higher than last talk. So every fail you may fail, but then when you come back up you will jump to a higher high, like in stock market terminology.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 32:08

I love it and it's so true. You will use all that experience and usually, as human beings, we tend to learn better from the negative experience unfortunately, that's true. Well, that's also an advantage of hitting those low points sometimes and learning and moving forward in a more powerful way, but also developing our resilience, because a long-term game of any kind requires resilience and certain qualities which you can't get without hitting those hard moments in life.

Sze Wong: 32:48

Right.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 32:49

And everybody is talking about success when we are referring to business, growth and those North Star goals. But how has your definition of success evolved over the years and what do you believe will be the new standard for real success among entrepreneurs in five years? Because I see the definition of what we can accept, of our human values and our behavior has changed so drastically during the last five years, so the definition of success needs to be redefined.

Sze Wong: 33:32

Yeah, certainly. So I told you about the when I closed my training school and I joined a company, when I left that company to actually went on my own way to start a new consulting firm. At the time the boss asked me so like, you think you can build something. So what do you think you'll be successful? And I said, well, I'm not trying to be a billionaire, I just want to have a few friends around me building cool stuff. That's what I want To that end. I got to that fairly quickly Now, once I get there.

Sze Wong: 34:10

So then my ambition started to change. I was like I'm on top of the world. I built a great business. I want to exit. I want to beat Microsoft. I want to beat them. I want to go to Mars. I want to go beyond Mars right. So that came crashing down, right. So, like, after a while I realized, oh well, I won't be going to Mars. Maybe my ash will be put onto Mars, but I probably won't be going there. Now you tune back to Earth.

Sze Wong: 34:39

Today I remind people to look at the world index of how rich you are. And if we look at the world's population, all of us, all of us, everybody around me you and me, everybody around you, everybody who's listening to this podcast. It's among the top 5% and so we're already successful. We're just fighting between the 3.32 to 3.01, right, the 3.32 to 3.01, right.

Sze Wong: 35:11

I constantly have to remind myself of that because so frequently I look at myself as I failed because we didn't go public, we didn't sell to Apple when we had the chance to, we didn't sell to like other big companies when we had the chance to. So to me, in one part of my brain, I failed because I fail my friends right, because I have friends working in the company. They should be multimillionaires, but they're not. But I have to remind myself again. So this is like talk to like. At the same time I coach people. It's I'm coaching myself. You are fortunate, we are all fortunate, we're the top 5%, maybe even 1% if you count the world's population. So be grateful, be grateful. So that's all I'm going to say.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 36:01

That is very true and very wise, so impactful, truly.

Sze Wong: 36:11

More to myself. That's more a message to myself than to like I'm not trying to be, I'm not this wise person. But I need to continue to remind myself because I fall into these types of same kind of like mindset and I now fully understand why super successful people go into depression. I have a taste of mindset and I now fully understand why super successful people go into depression. I have a taste of that and I continue to have to remind myself. It's good enough. I may not be a multi-billionaire, not like Bill Gates, but that's okay.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 36:44

However, you are here to discuss a multi-million dollar journey, so everything is not that bad.

Sze Wong: 36:52

It's not that bad. No, it's not. It's not. I have a rule about me. I have food to eat.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 37:00

Exactly, and I believe it also depends on the mindset, because when you see only the goal and you're motivated only in reaching that goal, once you hit the target you are done and you lose motivation and then it easily pulls you down and into depression. But you are driven by something else. You have your purpose and what you are building is so meaningful that of course it holds you above that level of risk of falling into those sad states. What boundaries or principles have you put in place to ensure your business growth doesn't compromise your personal freedom and happiness?

Sze Wong: 37:49

Right. So on that we always say within the company saying family first, so life comes first. I mean, it's not like I want you to take 10 years off to take care of your family, but we all know life comes first. So the boundary is that I look at business as a video game. So I play video game.

Sze Wong: 38:10

Now I don't play as much as I used to, but when I was playing video game I will work hard to play that video game. I want the best score. I want to beat yesterday, I want to beat somebody, I want to be good at the video game. But if I fail, if I don't pass that stage, I turn it off and go to bed. I'm not going to scream and kill myself. I will turn it off, go to bed, take a shower, go watch some Netflix and next weekend I'll turn it on again and play again. So while at the game I will play hard and learn the most and give my 100%.

Sze Wong: 38:50

But it is a game and business is like that. It is a mean to create the world that we want to live in. The world that we want to live in is the reason right. So if that turnaround, we only just do the business and forget about life, then what's the point? So we have to always remember. I always remind myself business is a video game, I can turn it off. I mean I don't want to right. So when I'm playing I don't want to turn it off, I want to be good, I want to pass, like it. Always I have that moment where I'm almost past, like let me just go, and when I wake up it was like 3. In the morning, right Not now, but years ago, it's kind of like that. But remind, I'm again reminding myself it's just a video game and play hard, but you should be able to turn it off and there should be something when you turn it off.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 39:44

I love it. I love it and it's such a powerful comparison because I see, unfortunately I see too many successful business people who are running their business as the most prioritized part of their life and, unfortunately, they don't even realize that and unfortunately they don't even realize that. So when we talk about it and we discuss family and children and friends, they truly believe that they are present there, while it is obvious that they are not.

Sze Wong: 40:22

Right. No, I mean, I'm guilty of that. I remember there was more than one time where we will go shopping right, we'll go shop for clothes and all I remember is just walking down, like hallways, like in the mall. I don't remember what happened. I don't know what we purchased because I was having a conference call at the time. I was walking with the families, they were shopping, we were all shopping, right, but I was just walking down, I was having conference call. My mind is not there and I'm guilty of that. And again, everything I talked about is a reminder for myself. I need to learn to turn it off and I'll try to do better. So, yeah, do better.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 41:14

So, yeah, we all need that reminder and it is so amazing that we create those reminders and reactivate them along our conversation, because we truly need those reminders and our ability to live in the moment, here and now, and be present. With so many distractions, so many streams happening at the same time, it is worth to focus on it and develop it and do something intentionally in order to be present. So that's great that we created yet another valuable reminder.

Sze Wong: 41:54

Correct.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 41:55

Z. What emerging skills, mindset or opportunities do you believe will define the next generation of thriving entrepreneurs over the next three to five to 10 years?

Sze Wong: 42:12

Yeah. So right now, I tell people be resourceful, and that has always been true, but today is even more true. Be resourceful means you look around and and use what you can use at the moment to do the most impact. And that's what be resourceful means and people call it tinkering or some people call it hacking. I like to call it being resourceful so you will utilize what is around you to solve the most problem Now, today. Why that is being more important than maybe 10 years ago or 50 years ago, is because there are way more new resources. That pops up every single day and it's actually very scary. I mean, I have more than I have.

Sze Wong: 42:56

Many people come to me and say, like I cannot keep up, Like AI is like so fast, so much new things come up and I cannot keep up. And my answer is yes, you cannot keep up. Don't try to keep up, but be there, Don't stop either, right? So it's funny when you feel like you cannot keep up, you gave up. You go like I'm just not going to learn. Well, I mean, no matter how slow or how not keeping up you are, so long as you're still learning, you're still ahead of a lot of people. So be resourceful. Don't give up. Continue to learn and solve real problems. Solve boring problems.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 43:44

Amazing and, in this case, exactly my recommendation always sounds like this slow down to speed up, Because that's truly important to have that understanding and respect for the process and understand that you can't always run faster and faster and faster. Sometimes you have to slow down, reprocess, regather.

Sze Wong: 44:13

Don't stop, slow down, don't stop.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 44:15

Yes, exactly. And then you will speed up just because you slowed down and got your resources into place. And I love your definition of this process. I love your definition of this process being resourceful, being tapped into your inner power and moving forward. That's exactly what it takes Amazing. I love our today's conversation, but we're coming to the last question. So what is the single most important advice you would give to those who aspire to achieve true fulfillment and lasting business success in the coming years?

Sze Wong: 44:57

It's simple Just go, just go, just go. Life is about unknown. Life is uncertain, those are certain. I can tell you, leigh, life will always be uncertain, life will always be scary, but you owe it to yourself to go, right. So you should go, just just. That's the simple advice. Just just go. Don't live in autopilot, right? So so this comes from a book called Die With Zero. Now, that's, that's not what we're talking about, but in that book it goes over and over again, like, don't just live by autopilot, it's so easy. So go, go, go.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 45:40

Fantastic. Thank you so much. That's so deep, so wise. I truly appreciate you and thank you so much for sharing your wisdom, your experience and your life journey.

Sze Wong: 45:56

Thank you. Thank you, Amy.

Emi Olausson Fourounjieva: 45:59

Thank you for joining us on Digital Transformation and AI for Humans. I am Amy and it was enriching to share this time with you. Remember, the core of any transformation lies in our human nature how we think, feel and connect with others. It is about enhancing our emotional intelligence, embracing the winning mindset and leading with empathy and insight. Subscribe and stay tuned for more episodes where we uncover the latest trends in digital business and explore the human side of technology and leadership. Until next time, keep nurturing your mind, fostering your connections and leading with heart.